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Pass set
I guysim connor and i play guard, right now my coaches have us in almost of back petal. When i watch the college and pro levels it is completly diffrent from what i am being taught and i like there method much better. in are method it just sets us up to get rollerskated back. Can anybody here help me with the pass set that they use at the higher levels or give me a couple of drills to help me out with it! thank you
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Taylor Boggs on
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Permalink Reply by Adam Gutglick on -
in third video, can u explain how he messed up the first time?
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Permalink Reply by Taylor Boggs on
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it really wasn't bad........his hand placement was good, he worked half a man, his biggest problem in that particular set was he did not stay square. He turned his shoulders right out the gate. It would have been better if he would have set more vertically and remained square, when you turn out the gate you make it easier for the defender to get up field as well as close the pocket. You also set yourself up for the inside move as well as failing vs line stunts
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Permalink Reply by K on
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Hey Connor. You need to listen to your coaches. What they are teaching you isn't wrong and if you watch you'll see the same thing at the upper levels. The most important thing for offensive linemen is that you all work as a team. You wouldn't be doing your job if you did something other than what your coaches are teaching your entire line.
Work as one.
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Permalink Reply by K on
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Taylor,
What I'm sure he is describing is a vertical pass set. To which a high school student might very well refer to it as "backpedaling."
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Permalink Reply by K on
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Taylor,
The inside-outside-inside-outside-anchor four step vertical pass set looks very much like you are backpedaling until you set after the 4th step. Not sure how someone could argue otherwise. I'm not a fan of either the vertical set or the terminology backpedal (as it leads to big steps) but both both are very common. I am confused as to your insistence.
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Permalink Reply by K on
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Taylor,
1) Lets understand that there is no universal terminology in football. What one coach calls a a post foot and kick foot another calls an inside foot and outside foot, a third calls a post foot and a set foot, a fourth calls a jab foot and a slide foot, a fifth calls... well you get the idea. Some coaches use the term backpedal to describe your four step pre-anchor in your vertical pass set. I don't personally as I previously mentioned...
2) Do you believe his coaches have him backpedaling like a defensive back would? C'mon man.
3) I don't teach a vertical set. We're mostly run so it would be an inefficient use of our time but if I was for example running a heavy passing-pure shotgun team having to deal with physically superior defensive lines I certainly would.
4) That said if you're actually looking for information you could contact (in the off season) Matt Moore the line coach at Texas Tech or Ron West (former OL coach) who is now the backer's coach at Illinois who have both been very helpful in the past and use common terminology. Google around a bit. I'm sure there is good stuff about. Maybe Texas Tech/Texas from a few years ago or LSU/Oregon maybe.
The point of my response isn't to argue semantics with you but to have the original poster realize that his best bet is to listen to his OL coach. The four step vertical set that I'm sure he is referring to is a valid method and he should ask his coach for tips and not random people on the internet. Since his coach obviously knows his offense better than we do.
I like this whole email me when you respond thing... Anyway have a good one dude.
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Permalink Reply by K on
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Taylor,
A wise man knows that he knows nothing... - Socrates paraphrased.
1) I couldn't imagine when I was a player (or GA, or Position Coach) ever going to my coaches and saying "Sorry I'm not going to use the blocking schemes and footwork that you've built into your offensive scheme but am going to use whatever X taught me." "Coach I'm not going to wrap when I tackle because when I watch the NFL I don't ever see anyone wrap they just put their head down and run into them..."
2) I'm sorry you don't want to expand your knowledge base beyond what you've been exposed to. Limited knowledge is apparently a positive... It is important to remember what level he is talking about and how skills and schemes translate at different levels.
3) I was just suggesting an answer to your question but it appears I was mistaken about your question being genuine. These are not friends of mine to name drop those are just people using the terminology and techniques mentioned. It isn't my pass pro scheme as I mentioned. I don't run it. Yet big time programs do run it and have had success doing so.
4) I haven't looked for it in NFL games but I haven't seen the packers do it. Their interior linemen seemingly always engage at the LOS. I wasn't looking for it in college ball either but I can tell you it is very common with any Air Raid offense: Texas Tech, East Carolina, West Virginia, Houston etc.
5) Check out what I'm referencing: http://brophyfootball.blogspot.com/2010/03/vertical-set.html video of Louisiana Tech practicing it.
6) Everyone does dumb stuff all the time. Like being a public figure and being hostile in a public arena for no apparent reason.
Anyway dude have a good one. A decade or two from now you'll view things a little different.
Original Poster: Do what your coach says. It isn't about you it is about the team. Find ways to improve within the scheme he has because there is a reason he has it. Do your own research about it and after bowl season is over during a lite recruiting period you might want to find another offensive line coach who runs the same scheme and ask for input (with video provided). You'll be shocked at how helpful people are when you're polite. But taking advice from a bricklayer on building a rocket is a bad idea. He might be an excellent brick layer but that won't be of any help to you unless you're laying bricks.
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Permalink Reply by K on
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Ah I thought it was for discussion. My bad it is for hostility and arguments.
As I mentioned "they don't do it in the NFL" is silly. As mentioned before they don't wrap on tackles either and just about every play someone puts their head down. Both are unacceptable technique. On a scheme level which is really what were talking about here since resetting the LOS four yards in the backfield is a scheme and not a technique debate the NFL didn't run any option before Tebow or any single wing before Miami and both were still valid (and proven such afterwards even in the NFL).
Helping a kid with his technique is a great idea. Telling him that the scheme should essentially be ignored because there is "only one way to do it" is silly. To improve his technique he should find a coach running the blocking scheme that he is actually using. As mentioned before there isn't much point in improving your bricklaying skills if you're building a rocket.
I wish you the best of luck in making a roster next year and in getting healthy. I would just hope that as you get a little older you begin to become a little more open minded. I'd laugh my butt off if some coach had you doing it in a couple years...
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Permalink Reply by Taylor Boggs on
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Hahaha oh its still a discussion for me there is just arguing taking place. It's Suspect that you would say this is hostility lol.
You can't compare not tackling to oline tech in the NFL. Coaches have small differences in their strategy for oline but its all based off the same principles. They aren't backpedaling outside of an uncovered center or somtimes naked perfections when if you get bulled it doesn't matter.
So the original poster feels like the way his coaches have him set puts him on skates. (It may work for some guys on his team but not him). Why wouldn't he try kick sliding? Are you saying you can't kick slide 4 yards? If he tried it and was right in line with the rest of his hogs and all of the sudden wasn't on skates, wouldn't that be accepted? I never once said ignore the scheme. But an individual has to find a particular technique that works for them. ( its not 1 size fits all. We all have a different anatomy and strengths and weaknesses).
And trust me I am very open minded. I never look at anything as right or wrong until I try it for myself. And even then I won't say anything is wrong I just say its wrong for me. I had 2 hs coaches, 3 college, 2 NFL line coaches and Lecharles Bentley as my trainer. I have picked up something different from everyone and I use all of it in mu arsenal. And i would laugh too. But I can almost guarantee it won't happen.
Wish u had a little for info up than "k" it kinds of takes your credibility away. Do u coach? Play? Retired? Wat?
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Permalink Reply by Sean Dalton on -
I personally agree with Boggs. From the terminology I've heard backpeddling is stepping back foot by foot. You better expect to be on skates doing this. However technique in high school isnt stressed like it is in college and pro. High school coaches no doubt over-simplify things to make them easy to understand. Backpeddling is an easy way to lose ground which is the basis for pass protection, especially the farther away from the center you get. Kick sliding seems like a relatively universal term. I think you should look into different technique Connor, but talk it over with you coach because don't do it unless you are gonna do it right. Different things work for different people. For example I find leaving my hands straight out infront of me during passpro leaves me very susceptible to hand fighting, I found I can leave my hands closer to my belly and still fire them at the right time for an effective punch. Although this is usually not taught, it works best for me. I hope your pass pro improves, as it's important.
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